2103 replies to this topic

[ora]

Danes smo malo debatirali na faksu na temo zgoraj omenjenega avstrijskega članka in o tem praprotniku so imeli tudi mnogi dosti povedat. Za članek smo hitro ugotovili, da je zadeva malo za lase privlečena, kar je sicer s parimi besedami celo v samem članku omenjeno, ampak publika pač pograbi kar je vroče in se prodaja. Ne morejo z neko študijo kao nečesa dokazat, če pa vse druge študije kažejo drugače, več kot očitno vzorec ni bil reprezentativen. Praprotnik pa da je v svojih vsejedskih časih že bil težak, zdaj pa je samo še slabši. Od tega da smo analiziral nek njegov nastop kjer ne samo z besedami temveč tudi z mimiko sporoča, da ni prepričam o tem kar govori. 

[tasya]

Rabila bi idejo, kaj dati namesto mlečnega namaza za vezivo za cake pops. Če bi dala samo kokosovo olje, mislim, da ne bi najbolje izpadlo, ker ravno vezivo da "tortast" okus.

 

Hvala

[Anouk]

Tasya, najbolje, da pobrskas na internetu ('vegan cake pops recipe', 'best vegan cake pops recipe' ali kaj podobnega) - sem prepricana, da bos kaj uporabnega nasla.

 

 

 

Od jutri v Hoferju:

 

LIZIN VRT
Presna gibanica

za kos 2,99

[Immortelle]

 

[Anouk]

 

Efforts to overcome vegetarian-induced dissonance among meat eaters

 

• Hank Rothgerber

http://dx.doi.org/10...pet.2014.04.003

 

Highlights

• The study articulated a range of mechanisms by which meat eaters reduce dissonance

• These mechanisms were applied to explain omnivores’ reactions to vegetarians

• It was hypothesized that vegetarians would increase dissonance among meat eaters

• This dissonance would be reduced in whatever way possible

• Five experiments showed that meat eaters reacted to vegetarians by reducing dissonance

 

 

Abstract

Meat eaters face dissonance whether it results from inconsistency (“I eat meat; I don’t like to hurt animals”), aversive consequences (“I eat meat; eating meat harms animals”), or threats to self image (“I eat meat; compassionate people don’t hurt animals”). The present work proposes that there are a number of strategies that omnivores adopt to reduce this dissonance including avoidance, dissociation, perceived behavioral change, denial of animal pain, denial of animal mind, pro-meat justifications, reducing perceived choice, and actual behavioral change. The presence of vegetarians was speculated to cause meat eating to be a scrutinized behavior, remind meat eaters of their discomfort, and undermine the effectiveness of these strategies. It was therefore hypothesized that exposure to a description of a vegetarian would lead omnivores to embrace dissonance-reducing strategies. Supporting this hypothesis, participants who read a vignette about a vegetarian denied animal mind more than participants who read about a gluten-free individual. It was also hypothesized that omnivores would be sensitive to individual differences between vegetarians and would demonstrate using dissonance-reducing strategies more when the situation failed to provide cognitions consonant with eating meat or to reduce dissonant cognitions. Four experiments supported this prediction and found that authentic vegetarians, vegetarians freely making the decision to abandon meat, consistent vegetarians, and anticipating moral reproach from vegetarians produced greater endorsement of dissonance-reducing strategies than their counterpart conditions.

 

Iz diskusije:

 

 

The chief barrier to reducing meat consumption is not necessarily a lack of contact with vegetarians, but how to help omnivores work through their defensiveness. Future research attempting to assist in reducing meat consumption should examine how to help meat eaters move beyond resorting to justifications and how to resolve dissonance in more positive ways. Again, it should be noted that it seems insufficient to simply raise the problems associated with meat consumption. For despite recent attention to these adverse consequences, meat consumption is on the rise. Indeed, the present findings may suggest that the negative meat campaign may be backfiring by ultimately increasing dissonance, which is alleviated by justifications that only promote greater meat consumption. This conclusion should be considered carefully though because it is unclear whether exposure to pro-vegetarianarguments produces the same, more, or less dissonance than exposure to vegetarians.

 

 

The present results are also highly relevant to better understanding the experience of vegetarians. There has not been a great deal of research on how vegetarians are affected by interactions with omnivores (but seeBeardsworth, Keil, 1991, Beardsworth, Keil, 1997, Jabs et al, 1998 and Jabs et al, 2000), a potential oversight considering that these experiences may help determine whether one sustains adherence to a meatless diet. The importance of having social networks (e.g., family, friends, membership groups) is an important factor in maintaining a vegetarian diet (Jabs et al., 1998); for example, 95% of their vegetarian sample was involved in a group that explicitly supported vegetarianism. The present work implies that one reason social networks may be important to vegetarians is because of the likely tension experienced in social interactions with omnivores. This tension is significant enough that many vegetarians reported feeling restricted in social settings because of their vegetarianism (Jabs et al., 2000). Some respondents decreased interactions with family members, particularly in events involving food.

 

Because the conflict within meat eaters is intrapersonal not interpersonal, even well-intentioned or sympathetic omnivores may fail to appreciate their role in contributing to awkward, tense social situations with vegetarians. The negativity would be compounded to the extent that vegetarians misattribute perceived hostility from omnivores; to the degree that vegetarians better understand how dissonance affects meat eaters, they may be better prepared to negotiate these interactions. As it currently stands, in-depth interviews with former vegetarians revealed that one of the primary reasons they returned to eating meat was a lack of support from friends and family (Barr & Chapman, 2002). While the intergroup dynamics between vegetarians and meat eaters may seem benign relative to a number of group identities – membership cuts across family lines, friendships are highly common across group membership, social life is not segregated along meat eating status, no history of violence between the groups, etc. – it is precisely some of this intimacy that creates opportunities for social dissatisfaction. It is imaginable that to some degree, dissonance-influenced interactions with omnivores may propel vegetarians into two concurrent yet seemingly opposite directions, the first being to more highly value and identify with their vegetarianism, the trait causing them social discomfort, and the second to hide this trait from others to avoid social discomfort, i.e., attempts at “passing” by withholding information about their dietary status to others (Jabs et al., 2000). Future research exploring the developmental aspects of vegetarianism should examine whether these seemingly contrary preferences can co-exist and more generally, take into account relations with and reactions by omnivores.

[Fluffy The Stud Eater]

[Matilda]

Ta zdravnik je tudi ful simpatičen:

 

[Kinky]

[Anouk]

Ta zdravnik je tudi ful simpatičen:

 

 

Prikimavam

[Matilda]

A obstaja kakšna dobra raziskava objavljena na internetu, ki bi dokazovala škodljivost mleka in mlečnih izdelkov? Nisem imela časa pregledovat vsega,

večina raziskav omenja škodljivost živalskih proteinov na splošno.

Ugotavljam, da je glede mleka večino člankov še vedno pro obarvanih, pač zaradi biološko dobro razpoložljivega kalcija.

Tisto, da naj bi mleko ful zakisalo kri, pa spet ne drži najbolj. Hvala za kakršnokoli pomoč.

[Anouk]

Verjetno bos mogla bolj specificno pogledat za spojine (kazein, nasicene mascobe, IGF-I itd.). Mogoce ti tukaj kaj v oci pade. 

[Immortelle]

But many scientific studies have shown an assortment of detrimental health effects directly linked to milk consumption. And the most surprising link is that not only do we barely absorb the calcium in cow’s milk (especially if pasteurized), but to make matters worse, it actually increases calcium loss from the bones.

 

http://saveourbones....osis-milk-myth/

[Anouk]

Immortelle, malo bolj kompleksno je tole.

 

Alkaline Diets, Animal Protein, & Calcium Loss

[Immortelle]

 

Tri veganke, stare 70+.

[Matilda]

Hvala obema! Immortelle, tiste citate iz raziskav sem videla ja, ampak so že vse precej stare.

Nimam pa pri roki Kitajske študije, niti je še nisem prebrala, čakam da jo dobim.

 

Da mleko zakisa kri in se zato sprošča kalcij iz kosti, žal ne drži. KLIK

 

Mleko ima drugače pH okrog 6.5-6.7 oziroma blizu 7.

Kri ima pH okrog 7.4. Ker je izredno pomembno, da pH krvi ostaja konstanten, se kri ne more zakisati kar tako, ker ima izjemno učinkovite pufrske sisteme.

[Kinky]

Včeraj sem bila na predavanju Milana Hervola o presnojedstvu. Gospod se tako prehranjuje že 20 let.

 

Bilo je zanimivo, super za moje pojme malo predolgo (3 ure in pol, LOL), pa malo me je zmotilo, ker je večkrat omenil napeljeval na Hare Krišno.

Vseeno pa ne toliko, da bi nam želel kaj 'prodati', vsaj jaz nisem tako razumela. Ampak vera je pač del njegovega življenja, kar razumem.

 

Bi pa pripomnila to, da je njemu lahko biti presnojed. Namreč ... ima ogromno, ampak res ogromno, posestvo, kjer si vso hrano pridela sam.

Občasno kupi samo banane, avokado. Vse ostalo sam pridela, prideluje pa vse, in sicer od jagod, solate, aronije, murv, pa vse do kivija, kakija, lubenic, in tudi melon.

Ni da ni, na tistih slikah je meni delovalo vse, kot da je pravi raj.

 

Za nekoga, ki pa nima lastne zemlje, pa je presnojedstvo (ki se mi drugače zdi super) skoraj nemogoče, saj dobesedno bankrotiraš, če moraš vso

zelenjavno in sadje sam nabaviti (sploh pa če kupuješ bio).

 

Na koncu so nam ponudili presno pico, torto in kroglice. Vse je bilo fantastičnega okusa.

[Anouk]

Kinky, veliko presnojedcev (ali drugi ljudje, ki pojejo vecje kolicine sadja in zelenjave) se dogovori s kaksnim lokalnim dobaviteljem (npr. s kom, ki prodaja na trznici ali bolj na debelo, ce se temu tako rece ), in lahko dobis precejsen kolicinski popust. Pa tukaj tudi vidim, ce gres recimo na trznico v zadnji uri pred zapiranjem, dobis skorajda zastonj stvari. V soli, kjer moja mami uci, so imeli pred casom Hervola za predavatelja - so povabili ucence in starse na predavanje o razlicnih nacinih prehranjevanja (so se dogovorili tocno, kaj bo povedal in katere stvari izpustil, tako da ni bilo nic verskega ali kaj podobnega notri, pa precej krajse od 3.5h ). So bili menda zelo zadovoljni. 

[Kinky]

Super ideja to glede obiska tržnice preden pospravijo, kot tudi, da stopiš do kmeta in se z njim zmeniš. Saj vem, da se vse da, če se hoče. Ampak res,

ko pa vidiš kako lepo ima vse posajeno ... se res vidim tudi sama kot presnojedko, če bi imela take pogoje.

 

Tudi meni je bilo predavanje zanimivo, vedno kaj novega izveš, vseeno pa se je res pretirano razvleklo. So nam pa postregli hrano, kar je tudi bil zelo velik plus,

da so ljudje (nekateri so se prvič srečali s pojmom presnojedstva) videli, kako okusna je lahko tudi presna hrana.

[Anouk]

Ja, na FB veckrat zasledim raznorazne akcije (bodisi v trgovskih centrih ali drugod), ker si ljudje hodijo po 10+ kg sadja naenkrat in se potem ze splaca malo bolj pogledat. Meni se je sicer ljubljanska trznica malo zamerila, ker sem naletela kar na nekaj prodajalcev, ki bi te kar na suho, ceprav jim das vedet, da nisi od vceraj. 

[Kinky]

Meni se je sicer ljubljanska trznica malo zamerila, ker sem naletela kar na nekaj prodajalcev, ki bi te kar na suho, ceprav jim das vedet, da nisi od vceraj. 

 

JA!! Enaka izkušnja, vedno me prinašajo okoli. Bastards. 

 

Drugače bi pa zelo rada poleti bila nekaj časa 100 % presna, da vidim kako mi bo šlo.